Forgiveness

Hello, and welcome to Our Podcast being effing honest, I'm Jennifer Wong. And I'm Charity Rodrigues. We invite you into our conversations about everyday issues experienced by everyday people. We share our stories with honesty and humor, hoping to bring people together in community by showing how vulnerability can deepen bonds when done with kindness and non judgment. We know it's tough, so we'll go ahead and go first

Okay, so today's topic is on. Forgiveness, forgiveness. Yes. And oh, I forgot. Like, what do you think of this as a title? Forgiveness is a minefield?

Hmm.

Too much? Too much, too.

I think forgiveness is more of like a healing. I don't, I don't know. I think forgiveness is more of a healing. It's like a benefit to the self. It's not something we give to anybody else. But ourselves. Something like that. I don't know if it's a minefield, it is, it definitely is. It can but why do we do it, you know, if it's a minefield, I don't want to do it.

The process or the the act of can be a minefield,

is what can be maybe can be, can be, so that change,

or it doesn't have to be is but it can be so. But I

or it could be forgiveness, minefield to, to healing, or minefield to freedom. I mean, forgiveness is freedom. That's the bottom line

field. To freedom, okay, I'm gonna go with that one, a minefield to freedom to freedom. So I looked it up. Because I was having a discussion with my husband, about, you know, forgiveness. And he's like, Well, you know, it's in the word it's giving, you are giving of yourself, you're giving something to someone else. Whether they take it or not, is a whole different thing. But it's to give forgive something. So he was like, oh, yeah, I got that part. But, okay, I looked it up, it says, forgiveness, a conscious, deliberate decision to release feelings of resentment, or vengeance toward a person or group who harm you. And I was like, okay, all right, I can I get that, that's fine. I can go with that. And then further exploration says that there are three types of forgiveness. So the first one is exoneration. The second is forbearance. The third is release. The first one exoneration, you are wiping the slate clean, like you just get a whole reset, you hit the reset button, and you can forget everything in anything, go back to an innocent time of you know, within your relationship, and everybody's all happy. The third, the second is forbearance. And that's a partial apology where the person will put some kind of blame something that you you did made them do what they did, and they're sorry, but it's not a total. Yeah, Mia culpa. It's just allows the person to be able to continue having a relationship with you, but they don't completely say that it's, it's their fault. And then the third, the release, it allows you to let go of pain, of anger, of resentment. It does not exonerate the offender or offenders, it does not require forbearance, and you do not have to continue that relationship. It just gives you permission to release to just let it go and move on with your life. So

where did you find that because I've never heard that. So I'm like, wow,

I just found that on the internet. It was a an article from this guy. I will forward it to you. And and I liked that I like those three areas because I just felt like okay, that I fit in one of those. Just going with the old school thing by able definition or you know what you always hear? I was like, Oh, how am I going to talk about this? Because I, I just like, I'm not there. I can't, and I haven't forgiven completely and absolutely, and, you know, in the situations that I was thinking of, but this, that definition, those three, oh, now I had an option of like, oh, okay, I see where I fit within the world of forgiveness. So,

and I think that's a big thing is getting rid of these old ideas and beliefs of what forgiveness was. So I grew up thinking, forgiveness, forgive and forget. And it wasn't easy, because every time I'd get around a person that I was angry with, or felt hurt by, it would just come right back up, and then I hated them all over again. So forgive and forget, was never going to work. But I felt like that's what I was taught. true forgiveness was is you just forget, and you let everybody back in and everything's fine and dandy, and you're the bigger person. Well, that never worked for me. And then when I started doing it, I learned kind of like what you had just come up with. There are rules to forgiveness. And when I would work with my hypnosis clients, we do a whole session just on forgiveness, because it's so healing. But like we talked about, it's also a total mind. Fuck, basically, because in your head, you're thinking you have to do something that is emotionally impossible to do. It's like how am I just going to completely forgive and move on with my life and let bygones be bygones? It's crap, it doesn't work like that. I don't, maybe a miracle happens where you are enlightened. But as a human being, I don't think it's that easy. It's not that easy. And some of the when, because I was trained by my teachers on forgiveness, and some of the things that I learned, like you had said about your husband, it's giving. And one of my teachers said, you know, when you've reached absolute forgiveness, when you can look at the person, organization or situation and say, Thank you for giving me this experience. Thank you for giving me the spirit experience, because, and I found that true. When I totally am able to forgive somebody, I see it as an opportunity for growth for me, instead of I was wronged and it'll never be right. Because before I just wanted people to pay, like, yeah, we're not going to be even until you pay. You've got to pay for this pay, pay pay pay pay. And, and when is enough, right? Like, right, really, when you're in that space? Do you ever receive full payment to where you're like, good? No, because it's not about them? Like you'd also said, it has nothing to do with them. Forgiveness is about ourselves, about setting ourselves free.

That's it? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, it's

not about them. They're gonna go on with their life half the time, they don't even know what they've done.

Yeah, that's true. A lot of people don't know what they've done, and they don't see the problem. So that's why Yeah, I had realized that a lot of things in my life was through my eyes. And that wasn't, I was projecting things onto other people that they have done with this slide. And they need to do X, Y, and Z. But I didn't communicate that with them. That was just my perception of the situation I had loaded that, you know, experience that discussion, you know, whatever, with all of this baggage or, you know, backstory, whatever that they may have been aware of, they may not, it didn't matter. And so a lot of times, I did have to just let it go. Like, why was I looking for forgiveness? You know, I had to ask myself that question. But the the exoneration is the one that we've been taught, like, if that's it, that just wipe the slate clean, get back to that innocent time, get back to that, you know, like, pretend that you didn't know all of this other stuff that had been revealed about, you know, the situation about each individual. And I agree what you said, That's not, that's not realistic, that's not healthy. That's not good for your mental health, your well being for your sanity.

So right, right. And, and I think I heard you say, I had to ask myself, because you'd said you kind of front loaded it. And then you had to ask yourself, why did you say why I want to forgive or why I'm angry. I can't remember. Well,

why am I seeking forgiveness from that? Yeah, do I want them to forgive? You know, what am I asking of them to forgive and I had to do a lot of, you know, exploration and intellectual to I try to be as honest as possible with myself and with whatever situations I'm in In. And that takes a moment like, you have to stop and pause. Because if you're not getting what you want, you're not getting any and I get it, you're not getting it have to look at okay, why? Why? What was my role in the activity, the situation? You know, what was their role? Did they have everything that they needed to understand what, where I was coming from? Did I communicate everything so that we were all clear, and we were all on the same page. And sometimes it's not, you're not on the same page. You know, some simple example, you could be like, let's go to the park. And you're like, Yeah, and you putting all of this, we're gonna have a picnic, and we're gonna go hiking, and we're gonna go do all of this stuff. And the other person is just like, I just want to go to the park and sit down. And we're just gonna chill. Like, that's it, we'll have some conversation now, I'll meet with you, I'll talk with you. But in a very simple, like, I really don't want to do 100 things. And here I am coming at it with but I, you know, I went to the farmers market, and about all these things, they made you, you know, these foods, and I bought out my best linens to lay out and, you know, then I got, you know, hiking shoes. Like, why didn't you bring your hiking shoes? Like, what's up with that we were gonna go hiking, like we're in the park. Like, why wouldn't you want to go hiking? You know? And it's like, yeah, no, you know, did you communicate all of that in advance? No, I did it. It was just an expectation that I had placed there. Because I was so excited. I thought, certainly, this is the level of excitement they were going to be at. So it's, you know, things like that, that you have to really stop and think and that's a simple situation scenario that I set up.

But you did say personal accountability. And I think that is a huge piece to forgiveness. Like, who created those expectations? Did I front load those expectations? Was it agreed upon was it communicated? So some because my teacher had told me, he wrote a book on emotions, and this was my hypnosis teacher way long time ago. And he said, Each, like emotion has kind of a mental construct. So forgiveness is the result of feeling anger, and anger is the result of feeling that we were done wrong. So either someone did me wrong, which we have to check our expectations. Was it me over expecting or was it really a wrongdoing? And then the other thing we we feel that was wrong is when we watch, like people being harmed, like children, you know, being harmed, we get angry, right, we get angry, and we want to do something about it. So we have to go back to I think that helped me to understand where I need to put my forgiveness and my understanding and acceptance, right, is it? Is it me that I need to forgive myself for having such high expectations and let it go? Or was there actually a wrongdoing? And then I have to find a way to forgive that wrongdoing? Because we can I have been able to like communicate the wrongdoing. But it doesn't necessarily mean that even an apology would do it for me, if that makes sense. So it's really about the self. I think there is a little bit of a balance, but most of the work has to happen inside of me. I can't expect here again, I may front load and expectation that they're going to see it my way. Totally apologize. And then everything will be fine. And that's not that's rarely ever the case. And I had someone say two things. Anger, and resentment is like drinking poison and hoping the other person dies. Or it resembles a snake bite, because if you think about it, a snake bites us. People don't die from the wound, we die from the venom that keeps coursing through our bloods through our bloodstream. So once there is an action of wrongdoing, and we let the venom keep moving through our body, we're the ones that are dying, they're done. They're off, they're gone, you know. Yeah. So it's really about working with the self really about working with the self.

That is so true. Wow. You put it that way. It's like last June, we do we do have to work a lot on ourselves. And I think that of the three I mostly operate with release, I don't like I used to want exoneration from the person. Sometimes I got the forbearance and that was never enough. And then I just I don't know as I was going along throughout life, just got to a point of I just have to let it go, I can't hold it in anymore. And so I have to be, I just have to release it. And it doesn't matter what the other person said or does, I don't care if they come in or not. But it also takes time, like I need time, yes, to let it not sticking to net, it not be so uncomfortable for me not to get so tight, and you know, grit my teeth. And I always ask myself, if I see that person, group, whatever situation, you know, walking down the street, can I? Am I going to just keep walking? Can I say hi, and keep walking? Or am I immediately going to turn around and run and hide. And, you know, when I can get to the point of length, I can just, Hey, how's it going? You know, and keep walking, then it doesn't bother me anymore. And I don't care. Like they don't have to come back and say anything to me, they don't even have to acknowledge it, they don't have to ever talk about it again, because I just don't care any more is not worth it. And that just takes time. I know I can get to that point. But I need time. And sometimes it'll be a lot shorter. Like there's a shorter window of like, whatever, you know, and I can reassess the situation reassess my involvement with them. And doesn't really matter in the greater scheme of things. No, okay, let's just keep going. But sometimes it's like, oh, no, we are stopped right here right now. And I cannot move I am like weighted with cement. And I'm not moving forward. And it's hard to try to let it go.

Yeah, it does take time I, I remember studying with Michael Beckwith on forgiveness, he had a CD. And a long time ago, probably. Let's see 2008 I was listening to a lot of his work. And he did a I want to say it was like an audio workshop on forgiveness. And what I really still remember to this day is he said, It's not some sappy, syrupy, spiritual thing that you just all. He goes, it takes work. And it takes time. It takes like consciousness on our part to really want that freedom. It takes that consciousness and willingness for us to look at ourselves, look at our part, to go deep. And, and then when I learned about the Heart Math, that this can't be of the mind. I mean, that's why it's a mind field. Because we're trying to do it in our mind, we have to do it from our heart. It has to come from this place of love and love, His grace, love doesn't keep score, love doesn't have a one up love doesn't make sure things are even it. And getting to that spot is really difficult. And well, it is for me, it's gotten way easier over the years. But it was really hard. And the other thing that I remember was my hypnosis teacher had said there are rules to forgiveness. And I was like, oh, there are. And I think, let me see if I can remember them all. But one of the rules was, you don't have to tell the person, you forgive them. You never have to say, Oh, I forgive you, that never has to happen. You don't have to invite that person back into your life, which I think was the third thing you had said on your definitions. And forgiveness is totally about the self. Those were the three things. And I thought that was so huge that I didn't have to tell the person. And I didn't have to bring him back. I thought true forgiveness is when I can be around them, and be completely calm and peaceful again. And that's not true. And forgetting isn't a good thing. Because we need to remember where we've been. And we're not to put ourselves again, for boundaries. I mean, this relates to our last podcast about boundaries. Because once you have these experiences, hopefully we grow and we learn from them. And there are definitely things in that experience that we should not just forget and put ourselves back in that space again, like that. Oh, I totally that would be totally irrational. Right? And there are some times where I've had forgiveness where I've gotten closer to the person. And there are other times where I've completely forgiven somebody and I've known we need space because it's just a toxic relationship, you know, because of my wounds, their wounds, my expectations, their expectations. I usually leave it to the wounds thing, because I think we're all wounded in some way and maybe that's part of my journey is to heal. So, you know, in it's all how we put it into our belief system or perspectives or whatever, right, whatever it is, how we throw it into our value system is eventually They have begin to believe in things and feel in the things. So, you know, for me, it's that we're all running around with wounds, some larger, some smaller, different ways, different places, different experiences, dear different expressions of these wounds, but I genuinely believe that we are born good. And conditioning and wounding creates this path that we have to walk on. So, like one of the first forgiveness as I had was with my mom, we have never gotten along. And even though I love her, because she's my mom, and there are things about her that are beautiful and amazing, which I will say I couldn't say that 10 years ago, that I think I finally came to peace, where I could forgive her, where it felt like it shifted, when I could say, you know, I imagined her coming to my house, coming through the front door in a wheelchair and not having any legs. And me standing in front of her and expecting her to stand up and give me a welcome hug. And I thought that is never gonna happen. That just can't happen, because she's so wounded, right? Just like as if she was in a wheelchair with no legs, she could not walk. It's the same that she cannot be the person I need her to be. Right, you know, and she never could, weather. And I think I had to take blame out of it. Because I want to blame people, I want to say, Well, if you would have just done this, and this and this, if you could just see this, this and this, why aren't you just this seems like total normal, common sense. But I think some people just can't see that. I know, I can't. You know, it's, as we talked, it's not about them. I know I cannot, I cannot sometimes see where I'm hurting people, I cannot sometimes move beyond something so that I can create a connected relationship. So I think the more I got in touch with that visual with my mom, I also saw myself in some instances without legs. And then I gave myself a break. And then guess what, then I quit being an asshole to so many people, you know, so it was just a really interesting, like full bodied exchange. And, and then I came upon the whole oponopono meditations from Hawaii, that are really good about forgiveness. They're beautiful. I'm

not familiar. What are those?

Let's see. And so I I want to put this out there that for the purists of whole oponopono, I'm going to say if I do get this wrong, I apologize because I studied it 10 years ago, and then I've kind of adopted my own version of it, so that I could feel it and understand it. And then I taught it, I would do guided meditations, but I which I thought as we did the meditation, recording, maybe I can do a version of her opponent ona which I will not call it that. But I will call it a forgiveness meditation that we could add for our subscribers as well. Okay. But it's basically this visualization where you get centered and you put yourself in front of people, organizations. I want to say things, but it's usually people or organizations that you have felt wronged where there's a disconnect where there's any negative energy in a relationship. And then in this visualization, you fill yourself with love, and then you share the love, you surround the space with love. And then you basically say to that person in this meditative state I forgive you for and then you also say, please forgive me for and I offer you loving kindness, basically. And it's very, very powerful. And I do a couple other little things that kind of cut energetic cords and stuff. But it's really powerful. And the first time I did it with one of the who knows my years of being on the self help train, but I was in a workshop with a man that did a whole pono pono meditation with the group and he even prefaced it. Well, no, I think after the meditation, he said, Now don't be surprised if people that you have not thought about or been estranged from reach out to you in some way. And I swear to you that somebody texted me within like a day of doing that meditation that I had not talked to in a long time of which we had a very uncomfortable relationship. A crazy sell.

Okay, that is crazy, is very crazy. But that's also wonderful to hear that you've had the opportunity to connect with that person and perhaps address whatever the issues are.

I didn't get I didn't that was the beautiful thing they reached out. And then I just reached back with a hello. And that was it. We didn't need to write I because I realized I don't need to bring this person back into my life. And I just naturally let it go. And that was it. And it felt good. It was like, Alright, cool.

are good. Do you find yourself? Or did you? You know, perhaps not now, because you've said you've been on the self help train for a while, you find yourself doing the same things with individuals where you were constantly seeking forgiveness afterward? Like, was there a pattern to what was going on in your interactions with people? Or was it sure every situation was unique to every single?

I think it's a little of both, of course, they seem unique, right? But essentially, the common denominator is me, in every situation. So when I would start shifting my behaviors through honestly, self forgiveness and self love, then the patterns changed. But yeah, I have patterns of Yeah. Total patterns, wondering, you know, what's that? What is insanity? Doing the same thing over and over and hoping for a different outcome?

Yes.

So there was a lot of that. Looking at by self is one of the hardest things I think we can do with honesty, it

is, it is. And just because you're looking at yourself with honesty doesn't mean that the other person is and or ever will write, you know, look at themselves with honesty. So you can only do so much. And you do have to get to that point of what's it going to take for you to let go move on. Forgive whatever you're seeking. Where What's that point for you? Because yeah, you're not always going to get what you want from another person, you're just not, you're the one on the self help train, they are not necessarily on the same journey, the same path, they could be just like, you know, I'm gonna put my headphones on and, and put my blinders on and I am fine. Don't care about, you know, anyone else like just, and this is what they need to get through their life to get through their journey. that's those are the, you know, the armors that they have put on themselves to get through. And you may, you know, yes, we are all wounded. We are all, like walking zombies in just going through life, because that's the way it is. For some people, but the majority of people, we don't know what we're doing, we don't necessarily taught how to communicate with people. And some of us were taught to communicate in correctly, like the patterns that were set up in our lives. Were not the most healthy, positive, you know, interactions. And this is just as a parent, you can read all the books you want to, and be like, Okay, I'm going to be ready. And you know, when this situation presents himself, I'm gonna say this to my child, but then sometimes, like, it's just not working. And you just resort back to what, you know, what is the quickest and fastest thing you can reach for that you swore to yourself? I'm never gonna yell at my child. I did this, let them see me, you know, feel angry like this because it scared me when I was a kid. I'm just not gonna do that to my child. And then there you are. You find yourself in that situation. You're yelling at your child and you're like, you know, I swore I wasn't going to do it. I I had all the steps and everything I was supposed to do. It just, you know, didn't work out that way that day, right? But you do have to have forgiveness with yourself so that you can hit the reset button with yourself so that you can move forward and try again. Like just because you had one bet 235 You know Episodes of like, whoo, could have done that better. We are all human. And you just need to keep trying.

Yep. Bam. That's it. That's it. We have to give ourselves grace. I think self forgiveness is way more powerful than forgiveness of others. But I think, yeah, you have to do whatever you're led to do, right? Yes, absolutely. And I think it's more of a being instead of a doing, I almost feel like for me, it wasn't the things I did. It was the things I allowed myself to be with, be with. Even having to be with how I admonished myself for yelling at my kids, like, just be with that. Be with that, and then be with this gunk in this discontent in my being. I couldn't really get past that I kept trying to go on the surface of that forward. And I mean, there was improvement, because there always is when we are conscious and aware. But it took a long time. I mean, this has taken a long time. And I don't think the funny thing, I was talking to my girlfriends recently, and I don't think it's taking as long anymore. There's something going on since COVID. I think change can happen so much faster than it used to. I mean, come on. We're in five G with our phones, like everything is happening faster. So why wouldn't it happen with us? You know, I think that's why there's a lot coming to the surface. But anyway, that's another discussion. But I just I guess I want to know, I don't know, I want to say that even though I keep saying it took me a long time. It doesn't have to take a long time. I don't think it does.

It doesn't.

And in all honesty, so but I have a forgiveness story that I love to share. This one did not take long at all. On that note. When I got divorced from my first husband, my daughter was four. And in six months after we like after I moved out of the house, the divorce probably wasn't even finalized for six months, maybe a couple months. I show up to my four year olds spring program, I think it was at her school. And her school is awesome. Because she was at a private school. It was all German based and we loved it. It was beautiful. And when we would go to these events at our school, these shows, they would have food like full blown German food, they would have wine and beer. It was an event. And so I show up. I think he had custody of my daughter at that time. But I was bringing her dress I bought her a dress to wear for this event. I show up to the classroom. I bring her the dress. And when I walk in, she runs up to me and she goes mommy, mommy, mommy, you'll never guess what I have a new mom. What are you you have a new mom, I didn't know what she was. I was just laughing and the teachers looking at me kind of funny. I didn't know. So I just brushed it off. And I said oh yeah, really? That's interesting. What are you talking about? And as she was trying to explain it to me, my ex husband comes through the other door with a woman on his arm and says, Oh, Jennifer, I want you to meet my fiance. And I went whoa, I didn't even know that he was dating anybody. I mean, this was really soon after our, you know, we were separated maybe six months. And here's he is engaged. So I'm blown away. I'm taken aback. And i My heart is sinking further into my stomach as I watched my daughter run up and give her this amazing hug. Call her mom. And then the woman's just all smug and happy and just smiling from ear to ear and I am thinking what the fuck is going on here. And I just like all my triggers go up. I am in a panic. I am totally traumatized. Like, but I didn't know it back then. And I'm my heart's beating. My head is swimming. I can't see straight, My cheeks are flushed, my blood pressure must have been skyrocketing. And I have to act cool. Because there's all these strangers. Well, not strangers, but her school is standing around watching this go down and I'm just like, Oh, okay. So they leave. I go back out my mom, my stepmom, my dad. My sister, my Auntie's had all come. So now my family's there. I walk back out to them. And I said, I think Keith is engaged. And Jay just called this woman, her new mom. And I was like shaking by now. I don't know what the hell like, it's awful. So she does her little concert and the entire time, I'm watching him with this woman. And then this woman has like a very grown daughter. What is going on? And I'm just thinking, new mom. No effing way. I am getting up there to that stage, and I'm gonna get my daughter before anybody, you know, I am just going to push my way to prove that I am the mom. I mean, the scariest thing in my world was to lose my daughter right to lose your child. Yeah, I didn't realize losing my child emotionally was just as impactful as a death. But that's what I was going. It was almost like I'd gotten a call that she was in a car accident. That's how my body was reacting. So I went up to the stage. And I said, Oh, honey, that was amazing. And she gave me a hug. And immediately behind me is her dad and the stepmom. And she lets the stepmom opens her arms and takes my daughter out of my arms. And so she's holding her and I'm just standing there with my job, like, what is going on? And then my ex husband looks at me and he goes, Jennifer, I want you to meet so and so. My fiancee, and as she's holding my daughter, she puts her hand in my face and shows me the big rock. Oh, yeah, we're getting married. And I was like, Oh, that's wonderful. And she turns around and walks away with my daughter. And I'm standing there. Motherfucker. Hardest thing. So it gets better. So then we're standing in line to eat our food. And it's always this big mad rush. And it's a long line. And I'm walking by the line to get to my family, because I'm just totally out of my being. And she taps me on the shoulder. I don't know where my daughter is. And she said, Well, now that we're all family, we just need to get along. I'm like, I don't even know you. And how do I know we're not getting along? What is up, I was completely devastated. So that went on. And then after that, my daughter, I would pick her up from school. And instead of running up to me, like she used to to give me a hug, she'd say, Why didn't my real mom pick me up? I want my real mom to pick me up. Oh, yeah. And she'd run off. And I would just be standing there trying to collect myself. And back then I had no tools. This was the breakdown before any breakthrough in my life. And this went on, and then I would have my daughter. And she'd say I want to use my phone to call my mom and dad. Yeah. And she'd get on the phone with them on speaker and they'd be having this lovely family conversation. And then I tried to have a conversation with my ex husband, which if anybody does this in the first place, I should have known better than to try to have a rational conversation with him. And I wanted to express that I think Jade is confused. I mean, she's calling her her real mom, I know she came out of my vagina. That's not possible. And he said, Well, there's no love at your house. And I let her know that this house is full of love. And this is her new family. That's what he told me. I was up against everything. I had every reason to hate him. And that bit she wrote in with I was angry. And so then that's when I had my probable stroke and was in the hospital for four days because they didn't know what was going on. I did a bunch of tests, and they showed all that stuff on my brainstem. And you know, that was when the doctor came in and said, you know, you're lucky to be alive, young lady, one more millimeter on your brainstem and you would be dead. And then I was like, oh my god, I'm alive. Yay. But then it sank in like I almost died. So during my hospital stint, I was there for four days. I asked my ex husband, can I please have Jade, I just really need to see her. I just need to see her and I didn't look scary. You know, there wasn't tubes or anything. I was the I was really in for observation. And he said, Well, you can't because I made plans to take her to Disneyland with my fiance. So he didn't let her come for two or three days. And finally my step mom and dad stepped in and said, Look, can we just have her for an hour we'll pick her up and did it and I did get to see her but the entire hour she was just like, I gotta go. I gotta go. I got better things to do. You know? It was awful. And it went on this went on for probably six to eight months. It went on for a while. So I during that time, I was now trying to heal my body because I'd had this stroke that I was I was unable to walk really. I had a cane three quarters of my body was numb. I was really really sick. So I'm in this process of trying to heal my relationship with my daughter heal my body. And I remember thinking, I can't even drive her to school right now I'm gonna lose her 100% I was terrified. And then I got angry. And then I hated them. And then I came across the secret, which was a big, like self help documentary in the early 2000s. And I ended up studying with one of the speakers on the show, I really resonated with him, and I felt it was a good place to be. So I took all my savings. And I went to San Francisco. And I did a two day workshop with 600 other people. And he talked about forgiveness. And he talked about this being an inside job. And he talked about freedom. And he talked about healing. And I thought, when I left there, I have to work on this forgiveness thing I just have to. And my aunt, who by the way, she's on our website. Now the one that brought us together, she went up there with me, she didn't do the workshop, but she always likes a good trip to San Francisco. So we shared the hotel room. And on the way home, I think we did drive separately because I knew like I think it ended on a Sunday morning and my daughter had another show at her school, this was going to be the next show months later after that first incident. So the entire seven hour drive from San Francisco to Laguna Beach, I was just practicing how I was going to be in my heart and I was going to be forgiving, and I didn't even know shit about forgiveness. But I just knew I had to do this. And during before this, anytime we were in one of these family gatherings where we all had to be together. My ex husband would carry my daughter everywhere, she would never want to hug me touch me hang out with me or see me and there were other events with the school. And I remember like being so sweaty, my armpits are sweating. My ass was sweaty, I was sitting on a bench I got there early to the show, I had my seat. And I was just sweating. And I thought, oh my god, I'm not even gonna look good. When I do this, this is gonna be terrible. But I knew I had to do it. They walked in. He was holding my daughter, he was trailing his now wife because they were now married. And and I walked up and I saw her, the wife and I hugged her and I said, Hey, how are you guys doing. And she was totally shocked that I wanted to hug her. And then my daughter looked and saw that. And she for the first time reached out and said mom, and I got to take her from my ex husband's arms. And she just held on to me. And I inside was so I like I want to cry. Now just talking about it was so impactful. It was like the moment I got my daughter back, I had lost her for probably about a year, it was really, really hard. And after that, things started to improve. And after that, I realized how powerful forgiveness is. And me just getting over myself and doing the right thing. I didn't need to invite them to dinner. I just needed to be cordial. And in tune with myself and grounded and being okay with whatever happened even looking stupid, even being sweaty and not having my armor on, you know, just being from my heart and knowing that I had to do this for myself first. And it totally shifted. So then it was like a few more months. And every night I would do meditation. And I would put pink light in their house just I would send love to their house. I'd imagine it because that was my house. So I could imagine every room in that house. And I put love in that house and I surrounded my daughter and I said you know what, if this is her new mom, so far, she's been amazing to her. She's teaching her things. She loves her, thank goodness. And I just put love on that. Six months later, they got divorced. I saw and I didn't even want that. I didn't even want the divorce because I wanted my daughter to have stability. I was like whatever it takes, you know, I just I learned to love somebody more than myself. I learned to love myself enough to be okay with it. I mean, there was a lot more work, but that was literally within 48 hours. So forgiveness doesn't have to take a long time to see results. But I think for some of the bigger things it took longer I don't know it's I don't even know I don't think it's linear. I don't think I can sit here and say A plus B equals C. I think it's different for everybody but I do know that the energy of forgiveness is powerful. while inhaling, and will change your life, I'm just putting it out there. Boom. Done. Drop the mic.

Yeah. Okay, well then there you go. Thank you very much everyone for listening today. Wonderful.

No, we're not done. We're

good jazz boom, right there. Wow, Jennifer, I swear you, like blew me away every time I talk to you. Oh, like I have not lived. I have not lived life. Like you have lived, you have fully lived embraced, like, you've gone through the marine training of a life of bootcamp. You know, you've gone through the muck, you've had the barbed wire, like pulling and tugging and ripping, you've had to repel up the vertical wall. I've just like, lady,

I don't know, maturity, you have to. We all have maybe not like that.

But you've suffered, you've had pain and you've worked through it, we all have

no but no, because the here's I'm the I'm thinking through, I'm thinking through all of these things that you've gone through. And my thought is, my life has been a series of you do things to avoid things. Okay. So like, my mom, was very much into someone, you know, the energy of the people coming into your house. So someone comes into your house, and the moment they walk out of your house, she was burning lavender and all this stuff to like, get that energy out of the house. So I'm just like, very aware of like, how does that person make me feel, Oh, that'll make me feel good cut that, like, I don't need to continue any further. Anything with that person, I don't engage. You know, like you're saying, like, you kept on going in, I just cut people and they're just like, No, I'm, you know, throwing water out my front door so that they're, I'm cleaning my house, I have to clean, you would cleanse your house, you know, with all these nice fruity smelling things and white flowers, and then you would throw it out the front door so that they're, like, call it malice toward the evil one. Or so I have a lot of people and things and situations and circumstances. My mom's thing was like, the door's always open, you're always welcome here, I'll always feed you and whatever. But then like, you know, when you left the she felt like, something's off that person. You know, oh, let's go everybody clean up and you're like cleaning and then you're like burning, and then you're, like, open all the doors and get the wave. And so I've just like, I don't, I don't know, a lot of stories like that, like, my one major situation was, you know, with a family member. And that was like the extent of it, everyone else that I have come into contact with throughout my life. I just have to just let it go. Like I do the release thing. I don't necessarily go back for you know exoneration, because I also don't like conflict. So I'm not gonna go to someone and say, You did this to me. And I want you to do, you know, I'm just like, I might say a little something. And then if I don't see any kind of reaction or Spark, I just let it go. So I and I think through a lot my steps and my actions and what I do so that I can see like, Did I do anything? When I'm reliving the situation? Did I do anything? Now I'm good. I didn't do a thing. I don't know what the situation is. I gotta let it go and just keep on going. So I don't have a lot of interactions with people. Really. I'm just like, wow, I think back. No, I mean, wow, did it. That way,

I only hope that the pain and the suffering, the work I've done is helpful to others. Like that is ultimately I mean, that's why I share this stuff. It's not for me, I've been through it. I've done it, you know, but maybe if one person just gleams hope or, you know, hopefully, it's good for the world in some way. You know, like, it's not just about me, it's not just about myself. Although I will say I'm I'm happier now than I've ever been in my My entire life, you know, and it's just my path. It's just my path. And we all just have our journeys. And sometimes I think, you know, I love that you've been with your husband so long and you are best friends, and you chat about things and you get along, and I think that's so wonderful. That's not my path. I don't have that. In my life. I get this. So it's just different, you know, it's just

different is different, it is different. And I'm trying to think, how would I have reacted? How would I have reacted? I, I know I would not have reacted the way you reacted. And thank goodness, you had the I don't know where without the connection, you do a lot of self help, and you have a greater connection with yourself. I think I have a different connection with myself. But do you have a more intent and a deeper self awareness that we don't always have what a lot of us need. And I don't know how to get to that deeper self awareness. I'm like, I need to go a little deeper with myself. I'm just like, I don't know that. I don't know if I'm capable of that. I don't know. I mean, I want it, I want it. But you were you mentioned that guy, Michael Beckwith, Michael Beckwith, you mentioned and I had another friend that had recommended him to me and I was listening to his, you know, his stuff. And a lot of things resonated. But I know I have a wall. I have a, like a real thick wall. And, you know, maybe there's a little screen window left at the front, where I kind of filter, let some information filter through. But I don't I don't embrace these things. As much as I think I would want to arrive I should or I could, I just I listen, I like to be aware. Like, I'm familiar with the secret. I can't remember that too. And it all came out. And I I read that book and everything. But at the end of it, I was like like everything. I'm like that with everything. And I don't know why I can't just go yes. Okay. This is like, I take a little bit and it's a very small percentage of like, okay, that sounds good. All right. That's something I can do. Okay, that's fine. And then the rest of it. It's left hanging, but I know to go a little deeper to go on a different journey. Maybe I do need to, in a wrap my arms, but I don't. I am incapable of doing that. Like, I'm just like, I but I don't know why. And I try to not be that way. But then I'm like, No, I can't do it.

Well, timing is everything. And I think because you said I want to then it will at some point reveal itself, if it's meant to be in and I had a teacher that said sometimes we're ready and we're not willing, and sometimes we're willing and we're not ready. And when they finally come together. It's like whoo, it's like fireworks. It's great.

That's true.

But I'm going to ask, as this is our season one closing episode. Yeah. Would you say that by us being effing honest, just with us together and doing this full season. I hope that it has helped you in some way. Because I will say it has helped me. I have gotten a lot out of doing this

it has helped me because it has opened my eyes it has given me words for conversation. It has given me words for feelings and expressions and experiences that I had swallowed, you know, perhaps and just like I didn't know how to express that. I didn't know how to say those words, but you had words for it. And I was like, oh, that's what I was feeling. Yes. I went there to you went a little deeper. I was like, and then I turned back around. I was like, Okay, now I feel better.

No, it has it has

and that is to be able, to be honest, to be honest with myself, to be honest, when I'm having conversations with other people. And I don't like to waste a lot of time now. Like I don't I don't want to just have a little chitchat conversation either. I'm talking with you and I'm talking with you with some depth with honesty. You know, it's not not that I'm Pouring out my whole life story right there in the moment. But I'm also not trying to just be holding on to people that aren't trying to hold me back. You know, hold on to me, would that embraces not mutual? And I'm recognizing that and it's like, it's okay. That's fine. Just let it go. And just move on. Keep on trucking. I like the being honest, and, and being open with myself and others. And so, ya know, I've learned a lot I learned, I've learned a lot, Jennifer. But what about yourself? What have you learned anything? How has the experience been for you?

It's been incredibly impactful. And I have learned a lot. I love hearing, the research that you do and the topics that you've brought, I've learned a lot, especially like the child assessment, I learned so much. And I've been more willing to move forward in that direction really asking myself what's holding me back. So there has been a lot of growth there. And just being vulnerable. I am. I mean, next season, I hope and embrace that we are going to have way more subscribers and listeners. And the people that we've had this season knowing my secrets has really been like, I have to keep like Who,

who, who is this good? Am I doing this? Right? Is this okay? Like,

holy hell who's gonna listen to this, and it's made me continue to check in. And like I had said earlier, this isn't about me. You know, it is, but it isn't. I mean, I could just stay at home with this, I didn't need to put it out in the airwaves for anybody to listen to. So I deeply believe that this is helping to create community. And it's taking my

role,

to a new level in my communities. With my friends, feeling more aligned with my authenticity, when I go into conversations, it's made me be more present and slow. Because I also know I don't need to share everything with everybody all the time. Right? But what do I feel is being drawn for me to say, at this moment, not just my mind, I've really come into my heart over the season, really learning how to believe it before I see it. That was my meditation this morning. My mind believes things once it sees it, but my heart believes it before it's ever seen. And I want to live there more. And I think that's what this is, this has been a big risk for us to take to do this. On so many levels. It has been so many we didn't know we were doing, though. And we're still learning. Yeah,

we are. We are but we've grown, I feel like we've grown like from the beginning, from where we started to where we're ending now. It's like, wow, Jennifer, like, take a look, we did all that like we did it. We opened ourselves, we kept showing up. And we kept improving, and we kept growing. And the other thing that you're asking about, and I thought was, I'm more present, like I listened more like, usually like loss of my own having a look a little dialogue with myself, half the time. But now because of this, I am listening more. And I'm listening to what people are saying, I'm listening to you and what you are telling me and I'm receiving versus listening to you with the anticipation of I gotta reply, I have to reply to you. So and I'm not thinking about what I'm going to say. And I was like, no, let me just listen like what, you know, what you got, let's hear it. So

that's beautiful. Well, I appreciate you charity, because you have done a lot of work to make this happen. All the sound all the workshops, so I appreciate you. And this is so fun. And let's keep going.

Now we are going to keep going and I appreciate you for being willing to take a chance being willing to be so vulnerable and so transparent with I mean we're kind of strangers like we knew each other but like right know how deep we were gonna go and I'm thankful and grateful that you're the kind that just like this is doing all right. But yeah, I like that go go attitude. Because me I was like, let me put the current in and then I'll just do my thing and that and I'm always seen that what I'm done. That's right. This is getting there. We'll figure it out. Like, that's it Jennifer. What I need to be bold, that's what I need to be bold. I'm like, I'm gonna be Jennifer right now. And I have to say that to my husband, so he's like, What are you doing? Be genuine. Oh, okay. Okay. So just follow my lead. Because yeah, I mean, me, like, not gonna do that. And he knows that he was like, alright, let's just go. Whatever. But now, it's like, Hey, we're gonna do this is really scary. But I think this is we're gonna be Jennifer. Oh, we're going to be we are going to be, we are going to be okay. Go. All right. Woman gender. Firstly, it's a situation. Whatever man is doing. So bad. Got her. Oh, my goodness. There you go. Thank you. Thank you so much.

Oh, my gosh, that's hilarious.

Lives in sight, like, those two are a little nutty. Whatever. We're happy, but we liked it. We liked it. We do. We are racing out here. So. Yeah. All right. Well, thank everyone who has listened. Thank you so much. We love and appreciate your coming back and listening and creating community with us. And we have awesome, wonderful things for the new season plant. We're going to be interviewing guests. We're going to be on YouTube. Hopefully we'll figure out the Instagram and other social media stuff. And you'll see that too, but just keep them coming. And we want to hear from you like ideas, suggestions, anything lose, you know, reach out. So thank you. Thank you. Yes. And thank you to that. All right. And here we are signing off for 2022.

Yes. Cheers, everybody. Cheers. Be effing honest.

Yay. Thank you for listening to being effing honest with your hosts, Jennifer Wong and charity Rodriguez. Subscribe to our show wherever you listen to podcasts. And if you have a suggestion, question or topic you want us to talk about, connect with us at www being effing honest.com And until next time, we hope you're always being effing honest